Being born and going through childhood is hard. Hey Alana, But you two are awesome. And most notably from the perspective of early retirement and financial independence, havingenoughmoney in advance has made this part of the split much less painful. Mr. Money Mustache SwordGuy Maybe so. MMM never made the amount of money the frugalwoods did during his working career. Also the tip box. Permies (those in Permaculture) dig gardens, fix things, make great food and enjoy quiet company while doing things together. I would even contact their governing body if they really do exaggerate or sensationalize the details of your life event. Living 2.5 minutes away by bike is a pretty close distance! Personally, I have found over 18 financial literacy organizations that every-day-people can volunteer for. MAD Wealth So the bad news is that there is definitely such thing as too late. At some point, the idea of working on a marriage sounds like hell because you have been waiting for so long to be able to escape it. Ive always thought marriage was a risky endeavor and to be taken with extreme patience. First, we were ignored. It isn't all sunshine and roses like we make it seem. 1. Chapeau. (phoenetic Massachusetts accent)]. 2. And reflected very badly on those taking part. I hope you keep sharing your experiences. Cheers to a great future for us all! It is hard to reflect and plan for your next relationship while you are in one, and it is hard to appreciate and treasure company when you have never enjoyed and endured solitude. Today I celebrate 17 years with the second Mrs. F. Change is inevitable, what we choose to do with it is our own. Reasonableness is required on both sides. Your approach is similar to how my European friends handle these situations down to earth and practical-minded with no shame. December 31, 2018, 6:36 pm. We can get right back to work on positive things to rebuild our lives. This was so sad to read, but thanks for your honesty and openness MMM. They are who they are and while you cant change them, you cant make the world any better by spitting venom back at them., This quote really articulated how I have been feeling of late and obviously applies to humanity as a whole. December 31, 2018, 5:44 pm. So I have already placed a number of holds on the 5 Languages of Love, which looks to be quite the franchise. The One Hundredth Monkey . And when this happens, not even the greatest advantages of a lifetime money surplus or a supportive network of great friends and family or living in a beautiful place can save you. There are some less expensive groups than the spendy happy hour ones. Its a shame he never wrote a follow-up piece on his post-marriage thoughts (she pre-deceased him by 3yrs), Katie Camel . And we do. salads, barbells, and bicycles, I like that one. I work for a Bank and to satisfy our CRA (Community Reinvestment Act) needs, we are required to volunteer hundreds and sometimes thousands of hours each year to teach financial literacy in low to moderate income areas. BTW I want to add that tomorrow January 1 is the first day of the year I turn 55. Odds are against you if you meet and marry in your twenties. Do you think its good to have one? They are who they are and while you cant change them, you cant make the world any better by spitting venom back at them. But I just wanted to remind you that a pessimistic attitude like that is very self-fulfilling, especially in the area of finding future love. Mr. Money Mustache is the website and pseudonym of 48-year-old [2] Canadian-born blogger Peter Adeney. Logistics matter a lot more than people realize, and this will ensure you see each other more often than if you lived a car ride away. Therefore, it was shameful for Mrs. Money Mustache too. We would like to show you a description here but the site won't allow us. I told her I admired how she kept her cool cus she told no one not even any family because she said she knew how angry we would be at him. ( 1961-09-27) Joey expects to be doing publicity work for Marilyn Monroe, but instead, it's a chimp that worked in a new film, "African Safari". Wow, when I read the headline I was really hoping that the topic of divorce wasnt personal for you. Your story made me think about my situation and motivated me to let my spouse how much I appreciate what she does every day. Junior Achievement morning shifts from about 8a-2pm at local schools or at JA Finance park There are discussion groups, people who like to cook, board games, running, hiking, etc. I liked how she put it best I was happy for 25 years but the 26th year was awful. Not all volunteer positions involve pure charity-feeding-the-lepers type action (just saying because it sounds like you could use a battery charge in your vollie time). Hope your son is doing well and my best wishes for you all in 2019. Im sure the initial feelings were not publishable. Speaking as a 21-year divorcee, life gets better and better as time goes on. January 2, 2019, 10:32 pm. Having babies of your own is even harder. Thank you. But guess what? (No surprise to anyone.) Seriously. I did give it a good try though and miserably have worked for crap $. December 31, 2018, 8:05 pm. 3.5 years in, Im still a work in progress but know that Im okay and can enjoy life, and experience joy. Thank you for sharing this MMM. Mr. and Mrs. Stevens first made the trip to Bognor Regis on their honeymoon, and the tradition has continued ever since. Glad to hear youre doing well and your son sounds like he is getting two parents who are going to be great at co-parenting. Any further commenters need to remember that we are not entitled to information about you, or your family, or anyone else ever. With all of this happening, its a wonder that we can remain happy and productive and even thrive as humans. Mr. Money Mustache said that when he became a frugality apprentice, he was punched frequently and regularly on his face. I sure could of used your advice then. I just had the best year of my life, largely because of the influence youve had on me. A good way to find them is to learn and engage in things you are interested in. Too many couples marry on passion and spur of the moment decisions. I have spent eight years recovering financially from a messy separation. On top of all that Im not allowed to leave the US (kids were born here), where I had never worked before and without any family. Were friends now (six years later). There are alotof things in life that are hard. Next thing you know, you will land a corporate job! If you have any land trusts in your area, they are usually looking for volunteers. Im thankful for this and all your stories, in that they will likely help people focus before its too late. Outside of work I spend about 4 hours a week without her. ThatGuy. And I find it to be important to pay attention to what peoples actions say, and how they can affect you, and how those actions affect relationships. My prior career doesnt exist in the US. look for your local community action agency), get as much as possible for free (get kids clothes from Buy Nothing Group on Facebook, ask friends to give you hand me down clothes for kids), etc. Mr. Smith represents a threat / battle / death to society. So if you havent already heard through the rumor mill, the former Mrs. Money Mustache and I are no longer married. Best of luck to you. Sorry to hear! Being married to the wrong person is such an emotional and psychological drag. Consider animal shelters, park/rec groups, etc- very people-interactive. We were in constant communication, sometimes daily about what was happening in our kids worldhomework, sports, friends, etc. Mr. Money Mustache But we can. Because sometimes life just serves up a shit salad and we dont have a choice in the matter, but wealwayshave a choice of how to respond to it. No judgment here. Here are some of the emotional impacts a divorce may have on a child: Young children often struggle to understand why they must go between two homes. It seems so much easier for those who are deeply rooted in supportive, non/consumerist communities. Sounds like you all done good. Toggle navigation. Welcome to the club! But I agree the odds are not good, and to Stans point the odds are higher than people typically state because we usually only reference the divorce rate; something I hadnt thought of but agree with. Take 100 marriages. In my experience, of folks in my extended family, the hurt and anger turns the kid into a pawn to hurt the other parent. Mr. Money Mustache And Id rather call it a good game a little early, rather than being a burden on someone else to take care of me. This is the reason why my wife (Mrs. RB40) . December 31, 2018, 5:44 pm. House hacking might be an option. December 31, 2018, 6:35 pm. December 31, 2018, 6:41 pm. Thanks for sharing. He was declared innocent by a unanimous / universal . She gave them down payments on houses, cash, cars, more college assistance, etc. Working from home, traveling by bike and eating at home save $, but its also lonely. That cant be easy to do with some people being what they are. Seriously though I hope they get through this ok. There are better ways, which I need to work on. I am going for the Fearless Maximum approach. Mr. Money Mustache A divorced friend told me that, when one door closes another one opensbut the halls a bitch. From the outside, it looked like a well-working marriage. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. Some of these (below) are nation-wide and some in Los Angeles County area only. Regional Occupational Program ROPss are all over the nation You got me on track to live life from a position of strength and positivity. September 27, 1961. December 31, 2018, 5:51 pm. My city also has a FIRE Facebook group that meets monthly in person. It's only with this blog that he really made it to multi-millionaire status. And it is important for these people to hear that although divorce is always difficult, sometimes it really is the best choice and there should not be shame or blame associated with this choice. They stay in the same guest house and follow the same carefully honed schedulenow accompanied by their three children, twenty-year-old Mary, seventeen-year-old Dick, and little brother Ernie. They both agreed that our children would still inherit a big chunk of change even if we both lived to be 100. My ex husband then started his turbulent time of realising the marriage was over and the window to work on it had closed. December 31, 2018, 5:49 pm. It's a comfortable space that allows for both family living and entertaining. Alana, your state may have a Master Naturalist program, which is a fabulous way to meet environmentally-minded folks. Besides lowering your expenses to bare minimum, maybe you can rearrange your house (sleep all in the same room) to rent out other rooms to pay for the mortgage and even have some extra money left over. and he sports a thick mustache and a huge, shaggy beard (a beard with lots of hair). Your statement that even the harshest moments come with a little golden key taped secretly onto their side rings true. Keep em coming! What year did Mr money Mustache retire? Mr. Been There Remember reading that some Buddhist believe that suffering is a path to Nirvana. Frogdancer Jones And if you dont choose to fight, a divorce doesnt have to cost much at all. Your choice to focus on the positive is very admirable Ive had to learn the hard way that cherishing both the good and bad in life is the only way to live in the present and to value future opportunities, Michael Peterson 3. 571 talking about this. December 31, 2018, 6:03 pm. Divorce rates have never been as high as 55%, and have been dropping for decades. Lots of quiet, introverted people get together and find friends amongst the rest of the gang. David Lowell Rich. Not too much in the specifics, but quite a bit in general, because about half of all marriages end in divorce, and I have found it can be quite a tricky minefield to navigate. Like almost everything else in life, human nature draws us to the easier but more destructive of these paths, and only self-knowledge and self-discipline can lift us out of that rut and place us onto the more productive one. Thanks for making all our lives better. I will look into the Love Languages book, thanks for the recommendation. If one kid was acting sassy or sullen all of a sudden, I collaborated with my ex. How does the happiness level of happy married people compare to the happiness level of happy single people? Yep the idea of a mediocre partnership just so someone can change my diapers sounds like hell to me. As parents of a 6, 4, and 2 year old sometimes life is incredibly hard where all were doing is surviving- but in the (many) moments of fun and smiles, its good to go a little deeper than just enjoying whats on the surface and realize the deep joy and bliss. There no perfect way to navigate this minefield and I cant imagine how difficukt it must be as someone with a cult like following. Life throws some curveballs alright and although Ive been fortunate in the marriage space, being married for 29 years, Ive definitely had a few beanballs thrown my way in other areas. Ive experienced the calmness of relief, followed by tidal waves of anger and resentment. 3) Survival, Survival, and Survival! Wow, great post MMM. Mr. Money Mustache talks about his divorce mrmoneymustache 15 11 11 comments Best Add a Comment glassgost 4 yr. ago I was kinda hoping he'd mention if his frugality was a factor or not. I want to FIRE so I can spend more time with my family and be the type of father and husband you are, so this news came as a shock and a reminder of how difficult marriage is. Write down the good advice they give. Sure, you want to see some earnings. Not a game of fairness, especially when children are involved. Skip-the-Hyperbole C.S Lewis has some interesting words on marriage in his book Mere Christianity, which he openly qualifies by admitting he has never married. A number of my friends have taken that angle, Stan, though not through crunching the numbers as you have. Hopefully this makes a lot of us reflect on what is really important. Also we never talked bad about the other. I am trying to reconcile the difference and determine what to use in my calculations. I am so sorry to hear about your split. My car is the cheapest reliable car I can find (2007 Pontiac G6 w/V6 engine). 2. Im reminded of a refrain from an old Dave Mason song there aint no good guy, there aint no bad guy theres only you and me and we just disagree. Good luck to all of you. I can totally understand what you went through. What a reminder to tell my wife know how much she means to me, and then to show her with my actions. I was still angry but was tempered by her methodical thought process. It sounded like you were a great couple. We happen to be going through a lot of life changes at the moment, and this is a great reminder that through the stress we need to focus on what is important for us, both as individuals and as a couple. Consider volunteering your time in/with/for a group that either supports your goals or has people similar to you. You gave me strength, hope, wisdom, vital knowledge and something to aspire to. With the rule of 55 with regard to my most recent 401K, I can technically retire. I hope the bump of divorce on the road to badassity doesnt deter anyone. It sounds as though youre both stellar role models. worked through the do-it-yourself paperwork and paid a $265 fee to the county court for the divorce. Ill leave you with one of my favorite jokes: You and the ex-Mrs have generously helped all of us with this blog and changed many lives for the better. The effects are cumulative like erosion, not temporary like moods or weather. Addendum #1: Case Study: Should Josiah buy his parents a house? Your formula seems a little simplistic. She spent that 6 months selling off many of the assets and giving big gifts to their children. Definitely. I bought the lowest-cost house in the neighborhood, just a 2.5 minute bike ride down the hill from the family house, and Ive already fixed it upandstarted hosting Airbnb rentals to help make it carry its own weight. I guess Joanna doesn't mind his facial hair (facial hair = beard and/or mustache). Ignore them if you can or shut them down. First of all, there is the effect on yourchild raising, which is a parents most important job in life. When you do not define yourself by your relationships with others it makes divorce, splitting up, etc, much easier because you can keep it in perspective. Dave Mason, We Just Disagree Timeless and true. January 1, 2019, 3:35 pm. DAYS LA long beach program to bring adults back into the work-force This can drastically increase your hourly earnings. You can be the best spouse in the world and have them leave you for a Bass player with a drug problem in an AC/DC cover bandwhich is the dating pool you will run into after 40. ;), Been There Done That My divorce and loss of five kids was the biggest tragedy of my life but has led to the best thing in life: a solid and reliable relationship with God that brings peace and eventually a new marriage. This is because conflict is a form of war, and war is the most expensive thing humans have ever invented. Emotions get heavy in these situations. As I am reading your post, I admire your strength to keep it cool through this tough process. I am really sad hearing this man. Re: Financial Volunteering (to stay busy/if lonely/need to give back/healing). Im 100% certain that I would not be a Mustachian or on the path to FI if I hadnt taken the actions I did when I did. December 31, 2018, 6:49 pm. Happy and healthy new year to you and your family! Divorce is flat out trauma. Cheers MoneyMan you continue to serve us with the truth as you know and youre a VERY generous man! Ill continue to use the surplus for projects and philanthropy just as before, but the point here is that ones relationship status does not have to affect their financial status. Current situation: student loans, a few credit card debts, still going to school at 33, and making $15.50 ( yaaay) , living paycheque to paycheque, about . Add to that a divorce where I left with nothing, as I don't believe in spousal support ( I know). Hypermilling could possibly decrease the cost of my gas by $1/hour (assuming you can get about 15% better mileage) or I could just drive a little faster (below the speeding threshold) and work to minimize delays when picking up a dropping off passengers. During this stressful time, I heard of similar stories from others who were also locked in a high-cost battle. Time to extend that badassity to my marriage! It doesnt cost much, gets you out into nature, and introduces you to others with similar interests. I wish my parents had divorced 15 yrs before they actually did everyone, especially them, would have been much happier. As for these other people commenting well they can go kick rocks. I survived and later thrived out of divorce (it was a process, 10 years). (I explain this to my friends before they get married.). The good news is that we have had about the most amicable separation that one could hope for, we all still spend plenty of time together and our son is still in the same loving environment he has always had. I read through MMM's blog 5-6 years ago. It ruins lives. I felt that the turbulence I had coming to my decision while trying to make the marriage work was replaced with relief once that switch had flipped. Ive already downsized my home to something half in value and Im hatcheting expenses like a Halloween psycho! It takes a lot of courage to share this information with the public. They told me, so change that or dont be that guy. The number 1 reason FIRE made so much sense to us was our desire to spend so much time together. I decided to keep improving my chances of a better paying job and decided to go to university. I know the hurt, especially at those times when you kiss your kids goodbye until your next assigned custody day(s) to spend with them, and how quiet the house can seem when its just you and your thoughts. Im so glad to hear you were able to find a suitable house nearby. Im sorry you were the subject of gossip, but Im glad youve risen above the nonsense with such a positive post. :-D. Our biology is against us when it comes to long, monogamous relationships. Everyone looks at the divorce rate, but nobody looks at the happily married rate when talking about marriages. I wish for the two of you, peace, in 2019. Wishing you and your family a happy, healthy and peaceful new year. And for those being nagged: you cannotignorethe requests of your partner for years, and expectthemto forgive you for that either. I wish you both happiness in the coming years. It is quite hard to stay positive and optimistic when your ex is abusing (verbally/mentally/physically, whatever), but it really is the best thing you can do. Much like all things in life, theres an ebb and a flow to post-divorce life. Point is many of the years were happy so 96% of my sisters married life was good. So the former Mrs. MM and I (mostly under her guidance!) Except its themost important company in the world and having it fail is not an option. My wife and I have learned so much from you and we are forever grateful for your contributions to our family and friends and this society as a whole. Ummm. 1) Find multiple healthy distractions. The opportunity cost of fighting is way too high in these situations. I am sad to hear about your divorce, but glad to hear that yall will keep mushing on as best as yall can. Thank you! Im most encouraged with this line though: Most of us (myself included) drift through the years, assuming we are doing a perfectly good job at being married, while unintentionally making all the same mistakes that everyone else makes.. But without my divorce, and my solitude time to absorb my lessons, I would not have the wonderful relationship I enjoy today. And heed the wise words of my own relationship and coparenting counselor, who noted that the first months after any divorce are the times of greatest conflict. Anonymous but divorce is hard and economically its often devastating so Im pleased its a topic on here, even if there are not many divorcing couples who will find themselves in similar financial circumstances. Their opinion of your personal matters are irrelevant. Utah Valley Same here. And read the other comments, to see what other people around you are feeling. It has been a hard year. [1] Adeney retired from his job as a software engineer in 2005 at age 30 by spending only a small percentage of his annual salary and consistently investing the remainder, primarily in stock market index funds. Marriage is hard, especially when you have kids. Given how long things had been sliding in my marriage it surprised me that in a very short period of time (no affairs) it was like a switch was flipped and I knew there was nothing left in me that wanted the relationship to continue. But at the same time, I feel we havebothalready learnedsomuch, that it seems almost impossible that the experience wont help both of us live better lives in the future. This article describes an anomalous social space within the field of homelessness in San Francisco, that of "pro" recyclers, homeless men who spend much of their time collecting recyclables for redemption. Hello Mr. Moustache, It is proof that the core tenets of Mustachianism really are universal, and truly lead to greater lifetime happiness. (hug). Does anyone know of good places to read advice about improving frugality while meeting your emotional needs? It normally shuts them up when they get a note from their press complaints commission. November 12, 2019, 9:09 am. My advice for anyone going through this She is great at keeping things close. In my experience and from discussions with others (women mostly so its a fairly skewed premise) the initiator has just already worked through the realisation and subsequent grief of the relationships end. Daniele. Mr Shirts Women may work when they need to or want to. He and his former wife worked for some time in the standard tech industry, then took retirement and have established themselves to be the most successful bloggers. Im excited to read about the new home, Airbnb, and all the positive possibilities that you are growing into if you choose to share. I look forward to hopefully reading some blog posts about your new place and your adventures in Airbnb in the future. C.S. If I was as strict as he was, I'd definitely be divorced by now. Trust and believe finding your site was a blessing. If this is the only alternative. Looking forward to see you leading by example that divorce doesnt mean financial ruin and damaged relationships. When the ball drops tonight, I start my second career which Im very excited about. Okay that was a dark plan. Go ahead and click on any titles that intrigue you, and I hope to see you around here more often. Unbeknownst to either she found out by accident. If this blog post inspires some to put the work into their relationship then thats great because I found that there came a point where it was just too late. January 2, 2019, 8:36 am, Your story made me think about my situation and motivated me to let my spouse how much I appreciate what she does every day. Complaints and insults generally wont make the cut here, but by all means write them on your own blog! Ray Singer, Dick Chevillat. I had no idea until I met up with Carl (Mr. 1500) at the MMM HQ last month and he mentioned it. Wishing you and your family a fresh start in 2019. We can choose to focus on how unfair the situation is, how we were right and we tried our best and the world still mistreated us. Marriage, even if it doesnt work out exactly the way you wish, is overall a winning concept. I have flicked to this site over the years but not read in depth. So aim to survive. Mr. Money Mustache Divorce Announcement At the end of 2018, Mr. Money Mustache published an article that blew my mind. Wow, my condolences. You continue to be a role model to me. My mom was a strong introvert but was a community volunteer in a wide, wide variety of organizations (one at a time) to fulfill her social needs. Divorce is tough. But this is usually a personal finance blog. January 2, 2019, 7:32 pm. I am happy that you are ok and I am looking forward to continue being mentored and inspired by your blog. It definitely is not easy. Some great video on YouTube of the two of them performing acoustically. It sounds like you and your ex spouse are both still amazing people and parents but it was also a good reminder to me that achieving FIRE wont make my marriage easier in fact having more time together will give us more opportunities to neglect or fight with each other if we arent vigilant. Building new relationships and nurturing old ones, and making sure we put outonlypositive energy to every person in our lives, including our ex-spouse. Their story was allegedly captured in a book and movie, both named The Shadowlands. Its a beautiful story and one of my favorite movies. Where De la Rionda brought to mind Dr Phil, with a mustache, dramatic cadence and appeals to what he described as common sense, Chipperfield, the lead defender, reminded me of Mr Rogers. I dont think its over simplified at all. Mr. Money Mustache was a thirtysomething retiree who now writes about how we can all lead a frugal yet Badass life of leisure at. For example, if you survived the financial crisis, you could have bought S&P 500 at 666. I found your writings during a personal abyss some years ago in my mid-20s and you really helped me. Thank you so much for sharing this post MMM! My ex and I did the same. Life is full of hardships. While I cant recommend any particular book, if youre looking for a great place to discuss this with other FIRE-minded women, check out http://www.reddit.com/r/FIREyFemmes. Im sorry to hear about your split. I would describe myself as satisfactorily married. This is a very personal matter between you, (the former) Mrs. Money Mustache and your family. And easier. I commend you on the cooperative divorce. One of the best things you did was move down the street from your child. The noted penny-pinching guru dubbed Mr. Money Mustache announced on New Year's Eve that he and his wife have divorced, writing in a blog post that they only spent $265 on the entire process. Both of us can remain retired and continue to live in mortgage-free houses with investments easily covering our living expenses, while sharing child raising expenses. December 31, 2018, 5:04 pm. Proceed with extreme caution is my advice. John Warlock Take a look in the mirra, ya dirty rat bastids!